Mild-mannered Mike Pence gets aggressive with Trump, Ramaswamy to spark campaign

Former Vice President Mike Pence, a typically mild-mannered and relentlessly on-message politician, took the gloves off during Wednesday night’s GOP primary debate as his campaign looks for a spark.

Pence frequently interrupted and talked over other candidates and rivals, ensuring he’d get attention on the debate stage.

He repeatedly confronted rival candidate Vivek Ramaswamy, who is polling ahead of Pence and seen as ascendant, lashing out that the 38-year-old was a “rookie” and telling him at one point that he’d speak more slowly to make his argument clear.

By the end of the evening, Pence led the candidates on stage in terms of speaking time at more than 12 minutes. It was a big surprise to many of those watching, though whether it will provide the missing spark to his so-far sluggish campaign is a major question mark.

“I did not have ‘Mike Pence will keep things spicy’ on my debate Bingo card,” former Fox News host Megyn Kelly wrote on X, the platform formerly known as Twitter.

Multiple former Trump administration officials described Pence’s approach as “aggressive” and refreshing for a man they said they personally respect, but were unsure how he fit into the current GOP primary landscape.

“I thought that Pence came out firing a little bit. He wanted to show he was aggressive because the knock on him is he’s just kind of so straight-laced that he’s not a fighter that the GOP is really looking for right now, so I think he tried to prove some of that,” Hogan Gidley, a former Trump White House and campaign official, said on the Line Drive Podcast after the debate.

Jeb Hensarling and Scott Reed, co-chairmen of the Pence-aligned Committed to America super PAC, argued Pence won the debate “by taking the fight to his opponents.”

“Mike’s character, experience, and sense of resolve were repeatedly on display throughout the night — making it clear no one is more battle-tested and prepared,” the two said in a statement.

Pence told donors on a post-debate call Thursday that he believes it’s important for voters to see the differences between candidates in terms of who will stand up for conservative values, and he pledged to continue taking the fight to his opponents moving forward, according to an official on the call.

Pence initiated the first big exchange of the evening roughly 15 minutes into the debate, taking aim at Ramaswamy.

“You got people on this stage that won’t even talk about issues like Social Security and Medicare. I mean Vivek, you recently said a president can’t do everything. Well, I got news for you, Vivek — I’ve been in a hallway, I’ve been in the West Wing. A president in the United States has to confront every crisis facing America,” Pence said.

Ramaswamy shot back that his plans for boosting the economy were not complicated, adding that he did not understand where Pence’s comment was coming from.

“Let me explain it to you, Vivek. I’ll go slower this time,” Pence said, adding that it was not the time for a “rookie” in the White House.

Pence later clashed with Ramaswamy over U.S. aid for Ukraine in its war against Russia, with Ramaswamy arguing the federal government should be cutting off military assistance to the war-torn nation and Pence insisting the U.S. could focus on problems both domestic and international.

Pence’s actions on Jan. 6, 2021, were also central to a portion of the debate, and the issue forced others on the stage to weigh in on whether they agreed with his refusal to reject electoral votes at Trump’s behest.

The former vice president said when he launched his campaign in June that he felt Trump’s actions that day were disqualifying, and he reiterated Wednesday his belief that Trump “asked me to put him over the Constitution. And I chose the Constitution, and I always will.”

That comment caught the attention of Trump, who skipped the debate and instead sat down for an interview with ex-Fox News host Tucker Carlson, where he said he had not spoken to Pence in a long time.

“I never asked Mike Pence to put me above the Constitution. Who would say such a thing? A FAKE STORY!” Trump wrote on Truth Social.

For all of Pence’s criticism of Trump’s actions after the 2020 election, he was among the six candidates who raised their hands Wednesday and said they would still support Trump as the potential GOP nominee, even if he is convicted in any of his four criminal cases.

Pence came into the debate with his conservative credentials well established, but strategists had long questioned whether he could break through in a primary where many voters seem to respond more to personality than policy, and where he still faces a chilly reception from some Republicans for his refusal to reject the 2020 election results, something he did not have the authority to do.

Pence’s team took a victory lap after the debate, believing the former vice president’s performance showed he is qualified to govern from day one in a way others, like Ramaswamy, would not be.

A Pence campaign official said they received donations from more than 1,000 small-dollar donors overnight following the debate. Pence has already qualified for the second Republican primary debate next month in California.

The question is whether Pence’s assertive strategy at the first debate will do much to shake up the primary race.

Recent polls have shown Trump leading his next closest rival by more than 40 percentage points nationally and by similar margins in early voting states like Iowa, where the Pence campaign is focusing much of its attention and resources.

A CBS News poll conducted days before the debate showed Pence polling at 5 percent nationally, behind Trump, Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis and Ramaswamy.

Pence also faces an uphill battle in winning over swaths of the Republican primary electorate who remain loyal to Trump and hold a grudge over his break from the former president on Jan. 6.

An Associated Press-NORC poll conducted Aug. 10-14 found 41 percent of Republicans have a favorable view of Pence, compared with 42 percent who have an unfavorable view. A Fox News poll conducted Aug. 11-14 found Pence with a 45 percent favorability rating among self-identified Republicans, well behind Trump, who was at 78 percent.

“I thought Mike Pence showed a little fire, a little gumption,” said Tim Murtaugh, who worked on Trump’s 2020 campaign.

“I just don’t think it makes a dent,” he added. “He did fine for what he set out to do, but I don’t see how he advanced anything.”